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There have been many tributes today following the passing of chat-show king Michael Parkinson, celebrating his style, his intelligence, and his humour – all of which is much deserved.
There were two eras of the Parkinson show, the first running from 1971 to 1982, and the second from 1998 to 2007. While the format of the programme remained exactly the same in these two different eras, the show itself was quite different, for, in its second incarnation, most guests were only going on TV to sell something – they were promoting an album, a book, or a film. That wasn’t the case the first time around. While Parky was always more than capable of getting the best out of a guest on any particular occasion, those guests had to be willing to want to talk, and talk in a serious fashion.
If the 1970s/early 1980s incarnation of Parkinson was a talk show, the 1998-2007 return was more a light chat show on the majority of occasions. This wasn’t Parkinson’s fault, of course. Times had simply changed, and the star system had changed, too. Tom Cruise, Madonna, and Tom Hanks are not Orson Welles, Peter Ustinov, or Bette Davis. By the time of the second run of Parkinson, the age of the raconteur, of the serious conversation on prime time television, was pretty much dead. There were still names that could deliver, and who would simply go on the show for the right reasons: to talk. But there were fewer, and the conversations rarely seemed so deep as they were first time around.
There were still many highlights in the 1990s and 2000s, but it is probably fair to say that it was the earlier run where Parkinson’s really important interviews took place (although as someone in love with the first five or six decades of cinema, perhaps I’m just a tad biased). I say “important” because lengthy, serious interviews of great stars and characters whose careers often dated back to the 1910s were few and far between. There was Dick Cavett in the US, but it’s fair to say that Parkinson’s more relaxed, genial front probably got people talking more candidly. The great stars such as Gloria Swanson, Orson Welles, James Stewart, Shirley Temple, David Niven, Ingrid Bergman, and Bing Crosby opened up in a remarkable way in front of Parkinson. He was intelligent with his questioning, and they were intelligent and thoughtful in their answers. And those interviews really are a goldmine for fans and scholars of film and music from the first 60 or 70 years of the 20th century – far more important than the scores of interviews they would have done at the height of their stardom under strict instructions from their studios.
It’s remarkable to look at the list of stars that appeared in, for example, the 1972 series: Robert Mitchum, Tony Curtis, James Mason, Shirley Temple, Gore Vidal, John Gielgud, W. H. Auden, Annie Ross, Jack Lemmon. As the years pass,ed we must assume that Parkinson got a name for himself not amongst audiences but amongst stars, and that’s when the older stars flocked to his swivel seats for an hour-long chat: Duke Ellington (not long before he passed away), Gene Kelly, Bette Davis, Fred Astaire (on three occasions), Gloria Swanson (twice), Mickey Rooney, Dirk Bogarde. It’s probably quicker to list the people who didn’t appear on the show during that era than those who did. It’s also probably fair to say that the only two major stars he never got to chat to were Frank Sinatra and Elvis Presley. Parky viewed Sinatra as the “holy grail,” and not interviewing him was a big regret, he but didn’t the feel the same way about Elvis. We all have our faults.
The reason why those interviews are so essential is because Parkinson was so damned good at what he did. He learned early on that the key to being a talk show host is to listen. So many interviewers on TV today could learn from that (particularly political ones). Check out the interview with Joseph Bronowski, and how little Parkinson says during it.
But he also loved and encouraged debate, such as that wonderful moment where he gets embroiled in a political argument with Kenneth Williams. It’s a stunning, classic piece of television. Who could imagine Jonathan Ross or Graham Norton getting involved in such a discussion, or even encouraging an intelligent conversation like that in the first place. Ross and Norton are great at what they do, but sadly there is no-one really doing what Parkinson did back in the 1970s and early 1980s – not just with Kenneth Williams, but also with Mohammed Ali, of course…and many others. There’s also the fact, of course, that the show often put together the most unlikely mix of guests, and then sat back to see what happened. Here we have Kenneth Williams with Maggie Smith and Sir John Betjeman. A Carry On star with the poet laureate – hardly the most obvious combination in most circumstances, but Williams was talk show gold – well-read, feisty, funny, intelligent, and quite happy to be controversial. And who else would have Muhammad Ali and Freddie Starr sitting next to each other?
Those interviews keep getting wheeled out on the BBC and on YouTube because they were must-see television, they are classics of their kind, and it’s unlikely we will ever see their like again. Is that because stars of today want to mould their image so carefully – and probably have to, as any slip they might make in a serious interview would haunt them forever on YouTube and Twitter? Would Tom Cruise ever share his feelings on an important matter in the way that Williams did? Or is it because audiences don’t want to see that kind of interview? Do audiences want to hear Tom Holland’s thoughts on life and politics, or do they just want to hear him name-dropping and telling us about how he felt in a spider-man suit for the first time? It’s probably a case of both. And I should add that I’m not singling Holland out there for any reason other than he popped into my head. He’s an intelligent guy, but what we want from our stars seems to have changed. We do occasionally see those kinds of interviews with actors on Sunday morning politics shows in the UK, but they are banished from prime time television.
Somehow, in some way, Parkinson knew almost instinctively how to bring out the best from his guests, whether they were classical actors, comedians, or scientists. It didn’t matter. In a lengthy interview with Barry Humphries (screened again recently following Humphries passing), he even manages to get the creator of Dame Edna Everage to speak candidly and openly.
When Michael Parkinson passed away today aged 88, he didn’t just leave behind hundreds of hours of entertaining television, but a contribution of hundreds of hours of social and cultural history. That is his real legacy. No doubt, the BBC will wheel out the same six episodes of the Parkinson show that it always does as a kind of tribute (edit: they are doing exactly that!). But what Parkinson really deserves is an uploading of ALL episodes from that long first run to iplayer or, even better, a succession of series by series DVD boxed sets. It is about time, and he deserves it.